Discourse 138 – The events at the Second Coming of the Son of God.

The time of the Second Coming.

The place of the Second Coming.

The appearance of the Lord.

The Rapture of the Christian congregation.

Biblical Christianity and its claim to sole representation.

Table – The Great Tribulation – classified by events.

The time of the Second Coming

Although the time of the Second Coming of the Lord is clearly stated in the Bible, above all in the Lord’s discourse on the Last Days, there have been repeated attempts in Christian circles in the past to put a different slant on it. The Lord tells us in Mt 24,29-30:

But immediately after the tribulation of those days (…) they will see the Son of Man coming on the clouds of the sky

Mt 24,29 "But immediately after the tribulation of those days the sun will be darkened, and the moon will not give its light, and the stars will fall from the sky, and the powers of the heavens will be shaken. 24,30 "And then the sign of the Son of Man will appear in the sky, and then all the tribes of the earth will mourn, and they will see the Son of Man coming on the clouds of the sky with power and great glory. 24,31 "And He will send forth His angels with a great trumpet and they will gather together His elect from the four winds, from one end of the sky to the other. Mt 24,29-31;

And since the Great Tribulation is an altogether familiar event in the context of the Last Days, this should be sufficient to clarify the time at which it occurs. But we have a second indication as well which confirms this situation from a different angle – from the end working backwards, as it were. In Rev 7,13-15 John has a vision in heaven of a countless multitude of people in white robes, standing before the throne of God, and one of the elders explains to him:

These are the ones who come out of the great tribulation, and they have washed their robes and made them white in the blood of the Lamb.

Rev 7,13 Then one of the elders answered, saying to me, "These who are clothed in the white robes, who are they, and where have they come from?" 7,14 I said to him, My lord, you know. And he said to me, These are the ones who come out of the great tribulation, and they have washed their robes and made them white in the blood of the Lamb. 7,15 For this reason, they are before the throne of God; and they serve Him day and night in His temple; and He who sits on the throne will spread His tabernacle over them. Rev 7,13-15;

So if they come out of the Great Tribulation, they must have been in the Great Tribulation previously. But at this time – in Rev 7,13-15 and after the judgment of the 6th seal with the return of the Lord and raising of the dead and rapture – the Great Tribulation is not over yet! (See also the Table The Great Tribulation – classified by events. at the end of the document).

After that comes the day of wrath of the Lord with its judgments of the trumpets and bowls . Therefore the Lord means in Mt 24:29 with his statement: "Immediately after the tribulation of those days" not "after the Great Tribulation", but after the tribulation of those days - that is this time period of the Great Tribulation. (So far, this statement by the Lord was wrongly interpreted here at Immanuel.at as "after the Great Tribulation"!).

Here at Immanuel.at you will find a great many texts offering detailed documentary evidence of this, so we need not go into the matter further at this point. The refutation in Discourse 135 of the views upheld by M. Seibel in his book "Must Christians go through the Great Tribulation?" will be found particularly illuminating.

(See also discourse 135: "The refutation of the Pretribulationist Rapture")

(See also discourse 61: "Is the Great Tribulation identical with the Day of the Lord and the Wrath of God?")

The place of the Second Coming.

There has been a whole lot of discussion as well, over the 20 years that Immanuel.at has been in existence, on the question of the location of the Second Coming and the Rapture. It is hardly surprising that such questions should be asked – after all, the disciples questioned the Lord about it even back then.

When he prophesied to them about this "Day of the Son of Man" (Day of the Lord), he also told them that on that day it would be as it was in the days of Noah and Lot. While the latter were safe with their families, the judgment of God fell upon the people and killed them all.

And answering they said to Him, "Where, Lord?" And He said to them, "Where the body is, there also the vultures will be gathered.

Lk 17,34 "I tell you, on that night there will be two in one bed; one will be taken and the other will be left. 17,35 "There will be two women grinding at the same place; one will be taken and the other will be left. 17,36 ( – ) 17,37 And answering they *said to Him, "Where, Lord?" And He said to them, "Where the body is, there also the vultures will be gathered." Lk 17,34-37;

The answer of the Lord to this question of the disciples seems at first glance obscure, and the disciples may well have been puzzled at the time as to what the Lord could possibly have meant to convey – and we will come back to this point later. But this uncertainty is only to be put down to the fact that the question – like all other questions in connection with the Second Coming of the Lord – is being seen much too narrowly.

The Lord does not come to rapture just a handful of Christians to heaven. In the course of the last two thousand years there are now hundreds and millions of them, dead and living, and they are dispersed all over the planet; and their Rapture will take place ‘in the twinkling of an eye’, in a moment, that is to say – all over the world.

(See also discourse 12: "Must the congregation of the Last Days seek out a place of refuge for the Rapture?")

The appearance of the Lord

And this brings us up against the real issues, namely – How will the Lord appear, what will be the attendant circumstances, how will the Rapture take place, and what will be the consequences for humanity – both for the raptured, and for those left behind?

But before we go into the matter of the actual appearance of the Lord at his Second Coming, we must go on to speak about an event which immediately precedes this appearance, and which is prophesied in many books of the Old and New Testament. This is the event known as ‘the Great Darkness’.

(See also chapter 04 "The Great Darkness.")

One reason for describing the darkness as ‘great’ is the fact that it reaches out to embrace the entire globe. Just as the appearance of the Lord will be visible right round the world, so too this darkness will prevail worldwide. Indeed it is even a precondition and preparation for the radiant glory of the Lord when he appears in this world.

Then again, this Great Darkness is a sign meant for the congregation of Christ. In the Last Days many false prophets and false Christs will come and claim to be the returned ‘Christ’ or the ‘Messiah’, and will lead many of the brethren astray. The greatest among them will be the first of the two Antichrists, the ‘lawless one’.

Then that lawless one will be revealed whom the Lord will bring to an end by the appearance of His coming;

2The 2,6 And you know what restrains him now, so that in his time he will be revealed. 2,7 For the mystery of lawlessness is already at work; only he who now restrains will do so until he is taken out of the way. 2,8 Then that lawless one will be revealed whom the Lord will slay with the breath of His mouth and bring to an end by the appearance of His coming; 2,9 that is, the one whose coming is in accord with the activity of Satan, with all power and signs and false wonders, 2,10 and with all the deception of wickedness for those who perish, because they did not receive the love of the truth so as to be saved. 2,11 For this reason God will send upon them a deluding influence so that they will believe what is false, 2,12 in order that they all may be judged who did not believe the truth, but took pleasure in wickedness. 2The 2, 6-12;

(See also discourse 86: "The first and the second Antichrist.")

This will be a powerful politician who will perform fraudulent signs and wonders, with the help of the powers of Satan, at the time of the Great Tribulation and so mislead humanity. As a result – and probably also out of the lust for profit – people will increasingly decide for lies and fraud and so choose injustice and lawlessness.

Because lawlessness is increased, most people’s love will grow cold.

Mt 24,9 "Then they will deliver you to tribulation, and will kill you, and you will be hated by all nations because of My name. 24,10 "At that time many will fall away and will betray one another and hate one another. 24,11 "Many false prophets will arise and will mislead many. 24,12 "Because lawlessness is increased, most people’s love will grow cold. 24,13 "But the one who endures to the end, he will be saved. Mt 24, 9-13;

As a consequence of this generally prevailing injustice, which will extend to the highest judicial offices in the land, completely unrighteous judgments will be passed. And as a further consequence, the love of most people will grow cold and there will be all kinds of terror – extending from purely mental ostracism and mobbing terror, with lies, fraud, hatred and denunciation, to physical armed terror, with murder, sudden death, robbery and extortion.

Now this Great Darkness preceding the appearance of the Son of God is a sign for the Christian congregation, in that it provides the certainty that this is not just another impostor who comes along and claims to be the ‘Messiah’, and so misleads Christian believers once again. 

The Christ who comes to earth on the clouds of the sky in the Great Darkness is the true Christ, the Son of God. To him God has given all power in heaven and on earth (Mt 28:18) and it is he, the ruler of the cosmos, who now appears in this world. And as Paul writes in the above passage (2The 2,8), he will slay this lawless one, the ‘son of destruction’ (as Paul also refers to him), ‘with the breath of his mouth and bring (him) to an end by the appearance of his coming’.

After that the Lord will send out his angels to gather his chosen for the Rapture before the great and terrible Day of the Wrath of God dawns. For his appearance is at the same time the start of the ‘Day of the Lord’, the Day of the Wrath of God.

The sun will be darkened, and the moon will not give its light, and the stars will fall from the sky.

Mt 24,29 "But immediately after the tribulation of those days the sun will be darkened, and the moon will not give its light, and the stars will fall from the sky, and the powers of the heavens will be shaken. Mt 24,29;

The sun will be turned into darkness And the moon into blood Before the great and awesome day of the LORD comes.

Joel 2,31 "The sun will be turned into darkness And the moon into blood Before the great and awesome day of the LORD comes. 2,32 "And it will come about that whoever calls on the name of the LORD Will be delivered; For on Mount Zion and in Jerusalem There will be those who escape, As the LORD has said, Even among the survivors whom the LORD calls. Joel 2,31-32;

The day of the LORD is coming; a day of darkness and gloom, a day of clouds and thick darkness.

Joel 2,1 Blow a trumpet in Zion, And sound an alarm on My holy mountain! Let all the inhabitants of the land tremble, For the day of the LORD is coming; Surely it is near, 2,2 A day of darkness and gloom, A day of clouds and thick darkness. As the dawn is spread over the mountains, So there is a great and mighty people; There has never been anything like it, Nor will there be again after it To the years of many generations. Joel 2, 1- 2;

Behold, the day of the LORD is coming, Cruel, with fury and burning anger, To make the land a desolation; And He will exterminate its sinners from it.

Isa 13,9 Behold, the day of the LORD is coming, Cruel, with fury and burning anger, To make the land a desolation; And He will exterminate its sinners from it.

13,10 For the stars of heaven and their constellations Will not flash forth their light; The sun will be dark when it rises And the moon will not shed its light. 13,11 Thus I will punish the world for its evil And the wicked for their iniquity; I will also put an end to the arrogance of the proud And abase the haughtiness of the ruthless. 13,12 I will make mortal man scarcer than pure gold And mankind than the gold of Ophir.

13,13 Therefore I will make the heavens tremble, And the earth will be shaken from its place At the fury of the LORD of hosts In the day of His burning anger. 13,14 And it will be that like a hunted gazelle, Or like sheep with none to gather them, They will each turn to his own people, And each one flee to his own land. 13,15 Anyone who is found will be thrust through, And anyone who is captured will fall by the sword. 13,16 Their little ones also will be dashed to pieces Before their eyes; Their houses will be plundered And their wives ravished. Isa 13,9-16;

(See also chapter 05: "The Day of the Lord.")

Whereas the Old Testament prophesies the darkening of the heavenly bodies as a sign of the beginning of the Day of the Lord, the New Testament places the second aspect of this event, the appearance of the Son of God, in the foreground.

For just as the lightning comes from the east and flashes even to the west, so will the coming of the Son of Man be.

Mt 24,22 "Unless those days had been cut short, no life would have been saved; but for the sake of the elect those days will be cut short. 24,23 "Then if anyone says to you, Behold, here is the Christ,’ or ‘There He is,’ do not believe him. 24,24 "For false Christs and false prophets will arise and will show great signs and wonders, so as to mislead, if possible, even the elect. 24,25 "Behold, I have told you in advance.

24,26 "So if they say to you, ‘Behold, He is in the wilderness,’ do not go out, or, ‘Behold, He is in the inner rooms,’ do not believe them. 24,27 "For just as the lightning comes from the east and flashes even to the west, so will the coming of the Son of Man be. 24,28 "Wherever the corpse is, there the vultures will gather.

24,29 "But immediately after the tribulation of those days the sun will be darkened, and the moon will not give its light, and the stars will fall from the sky, and the powers of the heavens will be shaken. 24,30 "And then the sign of the Son of Man will appear in the sky, and then all the tribes of the earth will mourn, and they will see the Son of Man coming on the clouds of the sky with power and great glory. 24,31 "And He will send forth His angels with a great trumpet and they will gather together His elect from the four winds, from one end of the sky to the other. Mt 24,22-31.

So here we have a second and assured identifying sign heralding the appearance of our Lord Jesus Christ for the Rapture. As he himself prophesies in the above passage (Mt 24,30), ‘they will see the Son of Man coming on the clouds of the sky with power and great glory.’

And precisely that is later confirmed in Acts 1,6-11, at the Ascension of the Lord, when he is taken up by a cloud and the two angels who are present make this prophecy to the disciples:

This Jesus will come in just the same way as you have watched Him go into heaven.

Acts 1,6 So when they had come together, they were asking Him, saying, "Lord, is it at this time You are restoring the kingdom to Israel?" 1,7 He said to them, "It is not for you to know times or epochs which the Father has fixed by His own authority; 1,8 but you will receive power when the Holy Spirit has come upon you; and you shall be My witnesses both in Jerusalem, and in all Judea and Samaria, and even to the remotest part of the earth."

1,9 And after He had said these things, He was lifted up while they were looking on, and a cloud received Him out of their sight. 1,10 And as they were gazing intently into the sky while He was going, behold, two men in white clothing stood beside them. 1,11 They also said, "Men of Galilee, why do you stand looking into the sky? This Jesus, who has been taken up from you into heaven, will come in just the same way as you have watched Him go into heaven." Acts 1, 6 – 11;

So just as a cloud received the Son of God on his ascension into heaven two thousand years ago, so too he will descend on a cloud of the sky. That, and the darkening of the heavenly bodies, are the infallible signs that we have to do with the Second Coming of the Son of God, who appears for the raising and Rapture of his chosen at the sixth seal, before the day of the wrath of God.

(See also chapter 06: "The Return of the Lord – Part 1: The Return and the Rapture.")

The Rapture of the Christian congregation

In this connection we now come back, as stated earlier, to the Lord’s statement in Lk 17,37:

And He said to them, "Where the body is, there also the vultures will be gathered."

Lk 17,28 "It was the same as happened in the days of Lot: they were eating, they were drinking, they were buying, they were selling, they were planting, they were building; 17,29 but on the day that Lot went out from Sodom it rained fire and brimstone from heaven and destroyed them all. 17,30 "It will be just the same on the day that the Son of Man is revealed. 17,31 "On that day, the one who is on the housetop and whose goods are in the house must not go down to take them out; and likewise the one who is in the field must not turn back. 17,32 "Remember Lot’s wife. 17,33 "Whoever seeks to keep his life will lose it, and whoever loses his life will preserve it. 17,34 "I tell you, on that night there will be two in one bed; one will be taken and the other will be left. 17,35 "There will be two women grinding at the same place; one will be taken and the other will be left. 17,36 "Two men will be in the field; one will be taken and the other will be left." 17,37 And answering they said to Him, "Where, Lord?" And He said to them, "Where the body is, there also the vultures will be gathered." Lk 17,28-37;

There can be no doubt that the disciples were nonplussed by this answer. They had asked the Lord where this special event of his Second Coming was to take place, and he responded with some story of a body, and the vultures gathering to it.

But actually this answer was not meant for the disciples, or even for the world of those days. It was an answer that it becomes increasingly urgent for us today, living two thousand years later, to understand. But for this we need to know a bit about the entire complex of events surrounding the Rapture, as the latter is described in the Bible overall.

And here we can be very grateful to Paul, who describes this event in great detail, with all the background circumstances, in 1Cor 15,51-53:

For this perishable must put on the imperishable, and this mortal must put on immortality.

1Cor 15,51 Behold, I tell you a mystery; we will not all sleep, but we will all be changed, 15,52 in a moment, in the twinkling of an eye, at the last trumpet; for the trumpet will sound, and the dead will be raised imperishable, and we will be changed. 15,53 For this perishable must put on the imperishable, and this mortal must put on immortality. 1Cor 15,51-53;

Let us just remind ourselves – in this enigmatic sentence above (Lk 17,37), the Lord speaks of a ‘body’. And here, in 1Cor 15,53, Paul speaks similarly of the ‘perishable’, and immediately takes us a step further towards understanding what is going on, by expanding the statement: ‘For this perishable must put on the imperishable, and this mortal must put on immortality.’

Seeing that in this entire chapter Paul is speaking about the resurrection, the Lord’s reference to the ‘body’ relates likewise to Christian believers and to their being raised on the Second Coming of the Lord. In the first instance, to the resurrection of the dead Christians at the Rapture. But Paul then adds, in 1Cor 15,52: ‘and we (i.e. the living) will be changed.’

So we are concerned here both with the dead Christians and with those Christian faithful still alive at the end of the Great Tribulation, on the Second Coming of the Lord. The spirit of the dead brethren resting in the realm of the dead will be raised and the Christian believers still alive will be "changed" (1 Cor 15,51). Immediately after the resurrection, the spirit of the dead will be incorruptible and immortal, and the living will also be "clothed," as Paul writes in 2Cor 5,4. In the process, their physical body will die, but their spirit will be imperishable and immortal likewise.

And this ‘clothing’ of the living is now what is referred to in the statements of the Lord in Lk 17,31-35. Let us just take another look at this passage:

Remember Lot’s wife. Whoever seeks to keep his life will lose it, and whoever loses his life will preserve it.

Lk 17,31 "On that day, the one who is on the housetop and whose goods are in the house must not go down to take them out; and likewise the one who is in the field must not turn back. 17,32 "Remember Lot’s wife. 17,33 "Whoever seeks to keep his life will lose it, and whoever loses his life will preserve it. 17,34 "I tell you, on that night there will be two in one bed; one will be taken and the other will be left. 17,35 "There will be two women grinding at the same place; one will be taken and the other will be left. Lk 17,31-35;

Let us begin with the statement in verse 33: ‘Whoever seeks to keep his life will lose it.’ We remember Sodom and Gomorrah: Lot’s family were enjoined not to turn around and look back at a city full of gays and perverts, which they had just left under the guidance of the angels.

But what does this mean for the Rapture? Well, with the Rapture we have a very similar situation to that of Noah at the time of the Flood, or indeed that of Sodom at the time when Lot fled from it. If we leave aside the physical details (already the subject of lengthy discussion) of the situation to which these god-fearing people were exposed, living among the perverts of their time (Gen 19:9), we can see that they were obliged – just like the faithful still alive in the congregation of the Last Days – to come to a spiritual decision.

Both Noah and Lot and their families had to separate themselves not just physically, but also and above all spiritually, from the world they had lived in to date. That was naturally going to be easier for those of them who most hated this world, which they in any case now had to leave. And the same applies, of course, to the Rapture.

(See also discourse 1133: "How and why the Great Tribulation begins: ‘The beginning of birth pangs’.")

And as was the case with the Flood and in Sodom, so too with the Rapture we find a time limit set. There will not be a ‘moment’ (1Cor 15,52: "in the twinkling of an eye", in a split second) allowed where a person might go fetch something, finish what they were doing or even think it over for a bit (Lk 17,31). Anyone who fails to realize this – like Lot’s wife – is going to end up dead.

And yet, to speak truly, it isn’t actually just the affair of a moment. There will be no time left. Anyone whose heart is not filled with disgust for the godless and perverse human beings of the Last Days will be in the position of Lot’s wife – they will need too long to break with the past. And running away isn’t going to help either: ‘Whoever seeks to keep his life will lose it, and whoever loses his life will preserve it.’

Only those who are resolved, in heart and in spirit, to flee from this nest of vipers on earth, while remaining still and calm and letting everything pass over them that comes their way, are worthily fitted for the kingdom of heaven and will be gathered and ‘clothed’ by the angels and carried up to meet the Lord in the air.

Then we who are alive and remain will be caught up together with them in the clouds to meet the Lord in the air

1The 4,13 But we do not want you to be uninformed, brethren, about those who are asleep, so that you will not grieve as do the rest who have no hope. 4,14 For if we believe that Jesus died and rose again, even so God will bring with Him those who have fallen asleep in Jesus. 4,15 For this we say to you by the word of the Lord, that we who are alive and remain until the coming of the Lord, will not precede those who have fallen asleep. 4,16 For the Lord Himself will descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of the archangel and with the trumpet of God, and the dead in Christ will rise first. 4,17 Then we who are alive and remain will be caught up together with them in the clouds to meet the Lord in the air, and so we shall always be with the Lord. 4,18 Therefore comfort one another with these words. 1The 4,13-18;

Just like the physical bodies of the Christians who have been dead for two thousand years, so too the bodies of the Christians still living will be dead after the Rapture – but only their physical bodies (‘whoever loses his life will preserve it,’ Lk 17,33). For their spirit has now been ‘clothed’ and they have been changed, along with the dead Christian believers who have been raised.

They will then all – like the angels and our Lord Jesus Christ (1Cor 15,45), and indeed like God himself (Jn 4,24) – be spirit and will have a spiritual body (1Cor 15:43-44; Mt 22:30; Jn 3:8). That is to say that they are henceforth immortal, and so also sexless dwellers in God’s dimension for all eternity.

Perhaps one final point needs to be made here. In the above passage (Lk 17,34-35) the Lord also says:

‘I tell you, on that night there will be two in one bed; one will be taken and the other will be left. There will be two women grinding at the same place; one will be taken and the other will be left.’

Usually this text is explained as referring to Christian believers who are taken and unbelievers who are left. There are some commentators who think that the believers are those who are left, and the ones who are taken are going to damnation. But of course this is complete nonsense, and testifies to a want of even the most elementary biblical knowledge.

(See also discourse 65: "The two men in the field (Mt 24,40): who will be taken, and who will be left?")

But if, in this context, we consider the arguments given above, it would certainly be possible, seen from a different angle, to find a Christian married couple lying ‘in one bed’ where one would be taken and the other left (think of Lot’s wife!).

So in the prophecy of Lk 17,37, ‘Where the body is, there also the vultures will be gathered,’ the Lord means the ‘body’ to refer to the faithful. As the dead believers are "changed" before their rapture, the living will be "clothed" and they will leave their physical bodies. Hence they will have to die, in a worldly sense, and thus are all ‘bodies’.

And with this realization, it is now a relatively easy matter to answer the second question which this prophecy of the Lord’s suggests, namely ‘Who are the vultures?’ (or eagles, as in some translations). Just as birds of prey instinctively find a body (or ‘carrion’, in other translations), so the angels of the Lord will find the Christian faithful wherever they are, either in the realm of the dead or all over the world, and change them in the same way.

Biblical Christianity and its claim to sole representation.

The Great Tribulation – classified by events. (LANDSCAPE)